Reggie and Ramon are the kind of friends who fight all the time. They met in a fight, and when they're not blogging, they can usually be found typing an assortment of tirades in a kind of modern warfare waged via text messaging and Facebook. Here, ATG presents a virtually unedited back and forth on a pressing issue of the day.
Reggie: I got into an argument with a friend recently who claimed that because Jada, Busta, Meth and Red, Cam'ron, Jay-Z, Eminem, and 50 Cent were all planning on dropping albums this year, younger artists like Drake and The Cool Kids were going to have to "take a back seat."
That can't be right though, can it? Granted, those guys are established figures in terms of claiming shelf space at Wal-Mart, but is that really where hip-hop's at these days? I mean I'm infinitely more excited to hear Wale's Attention Deficit (which probably won't sell much) than I am to listen to a bunch of dudes pushing 40 trying to relive their glory days.
That can't be right though, can it? Granted, those guys are established figures in terms of claiming shelf space at Wal-Mart, but is that really where hip-hop's at these days? I mean I'm infinitely more excited to hear Wale's Attention Deficit (which probably won't sell much) than I am to listen to a bunch of dudes pushing 40 trying to relive their glory days.
Ramon: It depends on who you ask. The big three albums from last week sold, bottom line. People listened and people paid attention. Asher Roth was hammered by Rick Ross. Though Ross just seems incredibly old and played.
Most of the buzz rappers are complete trash and none of them have albums out we can test the theory on, but for the time being Roth is the standard. Plus, I don't see Wale or Blu getting viral marketing anywhere nearly as expensive and forced as Asher. So yeah, the freshman have to let the big dogs eat.
They can leak MP3s until they're blue in the face, blog and rock shows, but the old model is still viable.
Moreover, until any of these newcomers can figure out how to make it work for them, I don't see their labels popping for an expensive, late '90s style album (when labels gave out inflated budgets and let talent splurge on guest verses). And since big '90s acts are all the rage these days in music (check No Doubt on "American Idol" or any lineup of any festival this season), the only relatively safe play is for the majors to push, like, Cam'Ron and Beastie Boys. Gen X is still shopping at Best Buy.
Reggie: So we agree that the old model of labels shelling out for expensive features and marketing campaigns is still around and working to the advantage of the older, established artists. Only a few new kids, like Asher with his machine and Wale and Kid Cudi (each with Grammy-winning super producers, Mark Ronson and Kanye respectively, behind them) have a shot at even competing on the Billboard front... at least until a more democratic business model emerges.
But sales aren't everything. Especially not to hardcore hip-hop heads. What about iPod space? Should I care if Jada or Busta are still chasing that "classic" album and, more realistically, a mortgage payment? It's diminishing returns, man. Those guys were my shit in the day, but they aren't doing anything new, so why are they still relevant? I LOVE Weezer circa 1996, but I'm not checkin for a Wuggie.
Ramon: Two words: City. Lights.
One of my favorite, freshly packaged hip-hop tracks from the likes of Method Man and Redman and Bun B and a wholly brilliant beat by some unknown producer no one gives a shit about. This is the transition we need. The bridge-missing link-path to upward mobility. Nobodies and newbies reaching out to veterans for symbiotic relationships.
When Ludacris spits on a Cool Kids song, it's both unifying and coldly calculated; vindicating and redeeming; a generational affair for all involved parties and the best way to cross-channel rapping income. More importantly, the end result is fantastic.
Jadakiss talking about respect is entirely meaningless, true, but he still raps like it's for supper. Long as Jada can sing the blues, he'll matter. I think you're snapping judgment on bundles of worthy new music. Back On My B.S. is a super nice LP.* The new Mos and Dilla cuts we've shared are bar-raising slices of pie. What's the problem?
To answer your question, you should care because these are top flight tunes being glossed over and that's a shame, sure, but specifically because this will only last another few years tops. Very soon, the CD industry will die, the homeless vets will have nowhere to turn, young guns won't want anything to do with the Young Gunz. Blame it on the nostalgia, but I maintain this aforementioned, temporary balance is netting incredible music.
After 2009, we'll have heard oft-delayed albums from Eminem, Dre, Jada, Meth & Red, Raekwon, UGK, Jay-Z, Busta Rhymes, and Reflection Eternal. This has to be the last hurrah for all these certified legends. Enjoy the ride. I mean I picked up a bunch of discs last week and haven't opened them because deep down I know these won't exist in five years.
Reggie: I think you just finished it, man. I think that's a wrap.
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Interesting discussion. I assume I'm the person who you had the argument with Reggie. So these are 2 posts that I put on a website.
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Wondering what's going to happen when rappers from the 90s reach their 40s and 50s. Dr. Dre rapped on Crack A Bottle and that went to number 1, so he's the oldest rapper to rap on a hit song, but 80s rappers like KRS or Rakim don't really have commercial success anymore.
Will Jay-Z still put out music 5 years from now with a significant following? Basically, do you think there will ever be a point when rapping becomes an ageless art that a 35 year old can be a new artist? Or a 50 year old will put out an album without people saying, "Get your old ass of the stage" or it being a big deal to see someone like Melle Mel performing. I'm interested to see if it will happen. Age doesn't matter in any other genre.
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In 20 years, a ghost writer could be 50-60 writing for a 25 year old.
I guess my whole point is that hip-hop has always been seen as an "thing" for the youth, but it's turned into such a business and respected artform by a large audience that how Paul McCartney puts out albums to big sales and concerts in his late 60s, why can't Jay-z or Snoop maintain a large fanbase that long?
Plus Beastie Boys are one of the 3 major headliners for ACL this year. Over John Legend, Theivery Corporation, Mos Def, etc. And theyre in their mid-40s. If they were 50, who would know or care?
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My point being that hip-hop hasn't been out that long. People imagine a 50-60 year old rapping today and think it's weird. But the 30-40year old rappers today will be 50-60 in another time in history when we are 30-40. Why won't people our age listen to the same artists we always have if we like the music? Let's be real. The music industry can't be predicted. In 91, if someone said people will still listen to new Snoop music in 2009 that would have been laughed at. In 99, if someone said that 10 years later Eminem would be able to sell over 600k in a first week, that would be ridiculous. That a Jay-z album would be anticipated. Lil Wayne would be the biggest star in hip-hop, etc.
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